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The Carson Trial – Day 51
Judge Douglas Yau Tak-hong told Carson Yeung he will make a ruling on Tuesday on the Birmingham City supremo’s application to have his trial on five counts of money laundering thrown out.
News.sina.com.hk reports that the District Court judge has told the court he needs time to consider the application made in the wake of new evidence being introduced to the hearings by the prosecution yesterday.
The three files would appear to back up Carson’s assertion that he had loaned money to film producer Abba Chan Tat-Chee but were not available to either the prosecution or the defence as they were held by the Independent Commission Against Corruption (ICAC).
The defence have made the application stating that it was unfair for Carson to be tried without having all the relevant documents made available to him. The prosecution countered that the documents hadn’t been made available to the police either and stated that the defence has had ample time to ensure the relevant people appeared in Carson’s defence.
This is the second time the defence has applied for a permanent stay after an initial application failed back at the opening of the hearings in April. The trial reconvenes on Tuesday November 12 at 9:30am (1:30am HK time).
Tags: Abba Chan Tat Chee, Carson Yeung, Douglas Yau Tak-hong
71 Responses to “The Carson Trial – Day 51”
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Almajir;, This looks to adding on another few months/years, ?
Any comments on my statement, ?.
This is looking good, about time there was light at the end if the tunnel
Dan,
If the case is thrown out,will CY be seen as innocent, and therefore have his assets released from the current frozen state?
Only when the appeal process is exhausted
If this does get thrown out and he does go down the appeal process do you think this has changed his positon with regards to the club? If his assets will still be frozen even carson must realise that if goes to a retrial that could be years away that the club cant survive that long even with investment on the date quoted from the BIHL latest statement. So basically what im asking from carsons viewpoint is this positive or negative with regards to carson keeping ownership of the club?
I don’t know mate. I don’t think anyone knows what Carson is thinking
Ok no probs dan, just another mad twist in the ongoing saga, somone should make a book about this ! ;)
Question is how limited are the prosecution rights to appeal? They are limited under English law.
I can’t see this application succeeding though – limited class of documents which were unavailable to both sides and won’t affect the overall tenor of charges. Might end up with an application to get all documents from the ICAC, if there are any more.
Mony, Money, Money (courtesy of ABBA CHAN TAT CHEE !!!)
I don’t “get” the huge relevance being put on the “loan” FROM Carson to Mr Abba.
The whole point about Money Laundering is where you get the money from in the FIRST PLACE.
Whether it be “Good” or “Bad” money, if you have got some money then of course you could choose to loan it out if you wish.
And, yes, I do know that laundering involves money IN and OUT, but it does not seem the source of the money has been established beyond reasonable doubt in this case so far.
In HK you dont need to proove beyond a reasonable doubt…. the onus is on carson to proove his innocence
*prove*
I too am confused, but the relevance could be the money being repaid back to CY which would show as large sums of money being paid into CY’s bank account from a convicted criminal.
Chan wasn’t a convicted criminal in the period in question.
It’s about the flow of money into and out of the accounts. Carson said Chan put money in his account as repayment for a loan, but couldn’t show the original loan details. This proves that.
Does the justice system work both ways ie if CY is proved guilty then he can appeal, if he is innocent can the prosecution appeal.
I don’t think the prosecution can appeal an acquittal but they can certainly appeal a stay
I think Carson should have a fair trial
I think his been using delay tactics ever since it started and its really getting boring now.
I hope in one way or the other it gets sorted by early next year, when you go to the ground there is nothing for the fans to cheer about, so much doom and gloom.
KRO DNM
I really hope the judge has had a gutful of all this & decides to throw the case out & then maybe just maybe we can start to get back to some sort of nomality
CY deserves a fair trial the same as any other man. This is a major blow to the prosecution and I can see the case getting thrown
Pannu, Yeung, not giving a s**t, now ICAC holding back, boy do we need a purge!
If the case is thrown out on Tuesday but the prosecution decide to appeal this, CY’s assets (whatever guise they are under), remain frozen until the process is completed.
Interesting.
Even if CY has not got the finances to pump money into BCFC, he might be in a position to rekindle friendships and networks that had previously been put on hold during the trial.
But surely if they were frozen for the court case they will remain frozen for the appeal, along with CY’s House arrest seeing him remain in Hong Kong and not allowed to travel
KRO+DNM
CY isn’t under house arrest. He’s on bail.
Yes, I didn’t know how to term it, that’s why I added he won’t be allowed to travel or leave Hong Kong.
KRO+DNM
These documents were unavailable to both defence and prosecution, therefore neither side has gained, But why have the prosecution sought to introduce them at this time, if they are going to help Carson?.
I think they have found out that Carson team have found out they have these documents, and decided to bring them out now as they know even if Carson is found guilty he will appeal and he would easily win the appeal when he announces they had these documents all the time. So in short they are attempting to steel his thunder as it would cost them long term. Its what he has been banking on all along (the appeal court) Its now down to the judge to decide if it would be a lost cause to let it go to appeal. I think he will have no choice but to rule a Permanent Stay and Carson walks with no appeal from the prosecution.
Ps the judge could offer Carson an adjournment to look at the documents just to make it harder for him to win an appeal, as if he turned the judges suggestion down the appeal judge would have a reason to say , well you had a chance but refused it. This could backfire on Carson if this was his grand plan all along.!!!! just a thought.
PPS Dan , I would appreciate your view on this.
…………….I think the court is now waying up the cost so far of this case and the time scale it has taken ,…I think the judge is ready to cut the cord with the possibility of it going on a lot longer
I think I agree with you Sappy Sad
*weighing*
Well at least that would bring an end to this madness.
I have to say he is one hell of a Gambler, lol
Ive being a season ticket holder for 20 years this year I’ve not bought one too disgusted. English clubs need to learn these foreign exports are ruining english football. They don’t care for the clubs no passion just gamble with football clubs. Clubs where working class men worked all week and saved to go down the football at weekend and take the kids as a treat for many years. Its now lost because our football club has being taken by these criminals. Always be a bluenose through thick and thin but its not bham city fc no more. Carson Yeung is a player all he cares about is living the high life and staying out of prison. He will sell the land St andrews is built on before he is out if this trail carries on. Anyone notice screen not working down the blues i don’t think we can afford to run it. Money has gone. 20 years of building to get us in the premier where we belong disappeared beneath our feet. Sad sad loss to a great patriotic club.
All we can do is Keep right on like we always have. we will get those days back in the big time walking up the Coventry road after a few cold ones hearing KRO song in the distance those days are worth waiting for. KRO SOTV
john – you’re wrong ref the screen. As I have mentioned on here, it was affected by an electrical surge and it was a case of waiting for parts. it happens.
Dan, what does it mean applied for a stay. Does it mean to stay in Hong Kong
I understand that there have been communication problems between CY and the club/supporters but I have to ask the same question again, if the case against CY is thrown out and he is found to be innocent then why does/would everyone hate him? He was in charge during some of my happiest times as a Blues fan.
well done Carson,
I knew he was innocent all along
bring back over a year at home undefeated, league cup wins, 9th in the Prem, loanees from Barcelona and the general good feeling you originally brought to the Blues before these false accusations started
welcome home
in Carson we trust
He is a very divisive character and I dont think any of us has any idea of what is exactly going on over there. I would be happy with his return if he has the finances in place and is innocent.
Hi AJ —
:-)
[I did explain, what, about 2 years ago? – why I settled for AJ – and at that time I didn’t know you were Daniel—so apologies. In ref to your comment in the “Day 50” blog]
…………………………………………
Re – Day 51.
With further clarity, it does seem that it wasn’t deliberate withholding of ‘evidence’ by the Prosecution, more a case of a late release of information from a Third Party [ICAC].
One presumes that this release would have been available to the Defence as well, so – imo – a rather limp-wristed attempt to get it written into the Court Transcript whilst smearing, yet again, Carson’s connections – because – imo again – the late release would have given good grounds for a Defence Appeal. With allusions to non-disclosure of evidence etc.
So I can see why the attempt to get it ‘written-in’ now was with an eye to the future.
I try not to respond to the out-and-out haters, (being banned from the Blues Main Forum till September 2036 is proof that one shouldn’t respond to everything – even though I don’t swear, it’s a heavy burden for sarcasm and ridicule).
On a blog you have to respond at times, so you have my sympathies there.
………
As you will realise, I have never been anti-Carson.
I have greater respect for him and his dreams than I ever did for the 2Daves-
–all of them supported Blues.
But the 2Daves used other company’s money, Football League grants etc – until they had to fund the Main Stand re-development themselves, so didn’t.
Sullivan loaned Blues Sutton’s wages for 6 months and reclaimed it immediately SKY paid up in August.
Carson paid for EVERYTHING himself. Mortgaged his home to pay wages for players and Staff at St Andrews.
Carson was the only investor and financial supporter of Blues from his Day One.
He didn’t have Rovdale and the ‘knicker shops’ loaning Blues cashflow money, and getting interest in return.
When we got relegated, after the Carling, Carson was arrested, his assetts frozen.
OUR FUNDING STOPPED OVERNIGHT.
Alex left.
Pannu then spent two and a half years of bringing Blues’ finances into a manageable and sustainable stream.
Backroom redundancies have been minimised – the Academy and Wast Hills transformed and improved 100% from the 2Daves’ reign.
…………………
I don’t know what Carson has done wrong. Honestly.
OK he lives ‘high on the hog’ –he’s a wannabe ‘wheeler and dealer’ —
If the guy was a crook, he’d have been surrounded by accountants and lawyers, busy burying and PR’ng for the last 10 years.
If the guy was a crook, he’d turn up at Court surrounded by neanderthal bodyguards and a wake of lawyers….he doesn’t he arrives alone in a taxi FGS !
I see some immature comments on many forums (and here today) – of how Carson and Peter have
bled the club dry, and excreted on the club for years. Jesus wept.
How can financial debt to the SOLE INVESTOR – [repayment of which has been postponed, obviously, with an asset freeze] — be construed as bleeding the club dry?
Without possibly 3/4 wages Blues have the lowest wage bill in the Championship and
to be only 3rd bottom is a bloody achievemnt in my mind.
Hughton, Much,Redmond, Butland,Davies, King etc went, and considering how they are doing at the mo –
I think that is good for our cashflow…just an aside :-)
I’ve followed and loved Blues from Pickering’s time AJ.
Never got involved nor understood ownership and things until the “Blue Revolution”.
If people want to consider owners “bleeding the club dry”…
-they should start with the Coombes, in percentage terms of income far greater than the 2Daves
-imo – for legal reasons –but I will call Gary P in my defence. :-)
…
Carson was a wannabe ‘mover and dealer’ – look at his silly ventures into land and “Real Estate”
– the guy was a dreamer –nothing more.
Not a crook.
Crook’s have explanations and witnesses and alibis and things.
Carson turns up on his own in a taxi, tells the truth that he doesn’t have proof or paperwork on some stuff…
…then it suddenly appears and I hope the world looks brighter for Carson.
I have a lot of gratitude for him and a lot of respect for his courage in these times.
FREE the HONG KONG ONE
:-)
PS:
Jeez that was long…very sorry mates and AJ.
Lot of sense in that Letsby
This perpetual state of limbo is the problem – it’s killing all of us. We just want the court case to be over way one or the other.
And I pray for a decent performance against Huddersfield tomorrow,
Simply amazing news
Tuesday 11 november will be the most interesting day for all concerned…………………………….
Ps Dan some story’s always have a happy ending………..maybe this is the final chapter….. maybe???
Which year are you talking about Mark?. This coming tuesday is the 12th November!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for correcting me Chris 12 Nov 2013
I have stood by Carson from day one, and will continue to stay by Carson…………..
Oh dear !
Shades of Monty Python’s Dinsdale brothers sketch creeping in.
The Carson is innocent OK come to the party …
I always thought Musolini was much maligned …
Spare me !
Focy
I have supported my club from day1 and I will always support my club.
i to have supported my club from day one and i will always support my club,
as for carson…i think ive said enough about my feelings towards him. KRO.
If hes found not guilty or its been thrown out of court good for cy.
People saying he will put money back in the club if this happens, I would like to take peoples mind back to what he said when he took over, 40 million every transfer window yea right I be watching.
The only good thing will be is the trial will be over and done with.
KRO
I am going to go against the grain here and I promise it is not to try and cause any controversy. I honestly believe that there is no intention of selling the club in the near future, I also believe that our best way forward is with the Hong Kong guys and not Palladini. I hope CY does get aquitted and if so I believe there will be major reinvestment to try and get us back into the Premiership, this is when he will cut and run, having recouped his investment. This is a win win for the club and I truly hope my comments are digested fully.
Dont forget we had our best days as a club ever under CY and who says this was not to continue if he had not been arrested? It will be a travesty if he was wrongly arrested on what could and should have been.but it would be typical Birmingham City.
I add these are my own thoughts and I have no evidence to suugest otherwise.
Why would the judge throw the case out of court based on this one bit of evidence that backs up Carson’s account of where some money came from? There are other questions regarding other sums of money that Carson has failed to back up with evidence
carson has finally got his get out of jail free card. he’s been waiting for a opportunity like this for ages. delay after delay. crime does pay it seems. why does the good things happen to the most undeserving ppl whilst bad things happen to the good?
i couldnt go today due to work commitments, but Tracy your bang on, if fans think that if carsons
case is thrown out that he will come back and plough million back into the club live in cloud cookoo
land, hes promised this and that and 40 million in the first two transfer windows and not delivered,
the fact of the matter is that he hasent got the money even before these allegations came out,
guilty or innocent the blokes got to go asap, end off. KRO.
Hey, if he gets off maybe he will carry on running the club as he previously did, firstly by improving and extending Ziggy’s contract and then loaning some overpaid and disinterested players and maybe increasing the expenditure with Asia Rays. I think PP should be given the keys of the city as well for his sterling work and personal sacrifices he has made for the club.
Pannus gone very quiet at the moment I think mr yeung has fell out with him but it wont be for long the transfer window opens in about eight weeks so he will sell what he can and prop up bihl and they will be mates again
Word from HK is that he hasn’t
Great result today well and truely needed kro
Typical, we find a new scoring sensation and then he gets sent off :(
I know and for the stupidest thing dont know why players on yellows cant keep their shirt on, drives me crazy,
He didn’t take it off.
I find it interesting tbat fans despise a man yet to be found guilty of anything yet accepted and chanted the name of a convicted sex offender who was on the sex offenders register. Odd values.
I agree Steve
People forget David Sullivan did 77 days in prison too…
How did he pass the “Fit and Proper” criteria when he bought WHU?
Cos the conviction is over 30 years old and wasn’t strictly financially related (living off immoral earnings IIRC)
Thanks for the update…
KRO+DNM
Not sure what to make of this new evidence, or CY’s request as it is the second time he has asked the judge for a stay of proceedings.
Hopefully the judge, who seems to know what is going on throughout this fiasco, my opinion, will come up with the right decision. I personally wouldn’t like to second guess and can’t decide which would be the best outcome?
If he grants CY his stay the prosecution will appeal, adding at least a year if not more to this trial, if the judge favours the prosecution then CY will appeal and counter-claim a miscarriage of justice along with an unfair trial, so, my opinion, the judge can’t win whatever he decides..
KRO+DNM
I think Carson is waiting for the decision of this stay prior to responding to Paladini on the purchase of the club.
My guess is the judge will decide against a stay and Paladini will get the green light to buy the club.
New owners in by the transfer window.
Except Steve O it’s actually physically impossible to complete the purchase of the club before the transfer window. If an offer was accepted now it might be completed by Jan 31 if we were lucky.
Fair enough. It just fits that CY has not responded to Paladini with regards to the sale. He must be in agreement to sell if PP is in the throws of doing so.
I’m praying for the judge to reject and the club get sold. I know Paladini is not everyone’s first choice, but CY is dragging us down and down.