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The Carson Trial: Chinese Media Reaction to the Adjournment
Reaction to the adjournment of Carson’s trial was reported widely in the Chinese and English-Language media in Hong Kong overnight. It’s an insight into how big this trial is out in the former colony with many newspapers and sites having reporters in the courtroom.
(note video is in Cantonese)
The judge’s remarks are widely quoted and make for some interesting reading alone. Many people (including myself) were surprised at the length of the delay but having read what Judge Douglas Yau Hak-Tong had to say it makes sense that he adjourned the trial.
Oriental Daily reported that the Judge said that the trial wasn’t a money-laundering trial – which is an absolutely key point. Whilst the Organised Serious Crime Ordinance (OSCO) which Carson is accused of breaching is complicated what they’re effectively doing him for is having a large amount of cash in his account and not paying any tax. The case hinges on where that money comes from – the prosecution say it’s as a result of money-laundering but the defence say that Carson was legitimately wealthy pre-2001 and that they can prove that. That in itself is interesting as there are major gaps in the known history of Carson and it will be intriguing to see how they are filled in.
The South China Morning Post piece quotes the Judge as saying that Carson wasn’t deliberately delaying the trial (which is the direct opposite to what Judge Stanley Chan accused Carson of the previous week) and that he believed Carson wanted an outcome as soon as everyone else did. However, Judge Yau agreed that Carson needed the time to ensure he got a proper defence and a fair trial – a mistrial wouldn’t be in the public interest and would end up costing the taxpayer more.
The Sina website quoted Ming Pao’s newspaper, stating the prosecution was now looking to call 19 witnesses, which has necessitated the length of the trial being upped from a minimum 15 days to 25 days now.
It’s clearly raised a lot of interest in Hong Kong – there was apparently a media scrum at the end of the hearing as people tried to get photos and quotes of Carson and I suspect that despite the case still being sub judice we’ll be hearing more about it before April. The hope is that by that time it will be nothing more than a titbit of information as Blues progress under new owners – the trial will not cause the sale of the club to cease but may extend the amount of time Mr Pannu has to source a new buyer.
Tags: Carson Yeung, The Trial
75 Responses to “The Carson Trial: Chinese Media Reaction to the Adjournment”
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Though I have some sympathy for C,Y’s plight, !!. It has now gone on far to long, and we still require security for our club, So please, someone, somewhere, !!. Buy us soon, !!!!!!!!!!!.
Almajir, thanks for the reports re the trial. You’re my first stop to find the latest news.
So, if it’s not the widely reported money laundering which I understand carries a minimum of 5 years. Do you know what the penalty is relating to the, what seems to be, a lesser charge of tax avoidance?
It’ll be a maximum of five years – that’s all the District Court can give.
That’s quite a change from being a minimum of 5 years, to a maximum of 5 years.
IF the original charge was money laundering, and has been reduced to TAX avoidance, this strongly indicates a lack of evidence by the prosecution.
Actually, there has been no change – I suspect it’s more that you were mistaken. No change in charge, no change in tariff – it’s more a correcting of misconception. OSCO carries a maximum tariff of 14 years but district courts can only hand out a maximum of 5 – and that has been the known case with this trial since it was confirmed late last year it would be in District Court.
33 archive boxes of files containing 4000 pages of evidence and 19 witnesses doesn’t suggest a lack of evidence at all to me.
Perhaps the summary could be “It’s not a penalty what many of us thought, it’s actually a free-kick in a dagerous position on the edge of the box”.
Good analogy
Can we sign the big bald minder who is looking after CY as a central defender?
I would like to ask if this intermediary time spent delayed would be classed as part of any sentence given -if found guilty-ie,Time less time spent in waiting for completion of trial.
If so these delays are only beneficial foe Carson Yeoung
I believe that would only be the case if Carson was remanded in custody – and despite the popular misconception Carson isn’t in prison at the moment – he’s on bail. Thus it wouldn’t count at all.
seems very harsh to freeze somones assets over what is effectively tax avoidence, no wonder he keeps trying to get them unfrozen.
The Judge said that the trial wasn’t a money-laundering trial. Some people on here better take note.
There are major gaps in the known history of Carson and it will be intriguing to see how they are filled in. That will be really interesting as his wealth accumalation is sketch in detail to say the least.
I agree that the trial will not cause the sale of the club to cease but I believe how quickly that happens will be affected as Pannu is clearly a legal advisor to Carson. It’s no coincidence that Carsons barrister friend PP is over there right now. The sale of the club I believe is a secondary matter.
I am of the understanding that Pannu isn’t advising Carson at all over his criminal case. He is very much dealing with the sale of the club.
Lee Clarkes statements about CY’s telephone calls with him, Carson watching DVD’s of every game suggests that he hasnt given up on retaining ownership, otherwise, given the turnoil and restrictions he has suffered, the lossof his father, attempts to put him out of his home etc, why else would he be arsed to maintain his obvious affinity for the club?
This is one reason the “we don’t care about Carson” song has always bugged me – I think he really does care about Blues.
Absolutely…..
oh and thx for the reports mate they really are appreciated
then why not do whats best for the club then and sell us asap so we can regroup in jan
kro
Almajir – Thanks for all your reports.
Yesterday, your immediate thought was that the five month delay was the “worst possible news for the club”. Are you now less pessimistic?
I don’t think it’s helpful but the thought has struck me that at least it returns to the background whilst the club can be sold. My fear is that it gives Pannu more time to be more selective with offers – Blues need it to happen now realistically.
Maybe CY will get a not guilty, seems that things are moving in his direction for a change.
I agree, he does care about Blues.
If he cared about our club he wouldn’t have turned us into a circus. If he cared for the club he would have made at least one statement to us.
He has damaged us in the short and long term; these are not the actions of someone who “cares”
Then again I could be wrong and he’s innocent…………..
KRO
Turned us into a circus?
Do you remember Sullivan, Gold and Brady?
Barry Fry?
The Kumars?
Ken Wheldon?
We’ve been a circus at times for donkeys pal, this is nothing new.
And as for damaged us – yeah, winning a major trophy for the first time in 50 years and a brilliant European tour were just horrible.
It’s not all been bad – not at all. People moaned about the lack of ambition, the lack of a chairman spending money. Carson splashes out millions on Zigic in transfer fee and wages, millions on Hleb (you know he was on upwards of 65k a week with us – 3mil a year plus?), 50k per week on players like Martins, Bentley, Foster – yet people say he doesn’t care about us…
Also, the silence thing is cultural. In that part of the world, if something like this happens to you, you dont go blabbing to the press or go getting yourself noticed. He is probably humiliated and feeling much shame (if guilty, maybe just for getting caught rather than the action) and until this matter is resolved will not speak to anyone other than the people who are close to him
He cares that much that not only did he pay out all that in wages, he also gave sully/gold about 50million quid over the top, and nobody new it was just because he cares so much for us.lol
Im sure he wanted to be arrested!!! So what if he is innocent? He will be due a lot of compensation.!
Almajir mate – I agree with lots of what you think and write and I also remember wheldon – kumars – cockney shysters and beyond BUT I cant agree with you or anyone else who gives one ounce of credit to the Barber for the trophy europe etc etc – it was nothing to do with his stewardship and we all know how naive and stupid he was to be duped into the Zigic hleb bentley etc deals – The man by his own actions has placed himself between a rock and a hard place and it is BCFC and fans who are suffering and suffering we are through no fault of our own !!!!!!! The man is a business man ( poor one at that ) who now teeters on the brink !!!!! lets hope the club is sold promto
But if we hadn’t spent the money people would have massively whinged.
There is no winning with some people.
I don’t see how a comparison can be made between Carson and the previous owners Al; we were stable, had our best years in the prem and they rescued us from turning into thin air- which Wheldon and the Kumars came very close to doing.
You also mention Barry Fry; the first manager in my lifetime to actually sign some promising footballers. Yes he was tongue in cheek but at least gave us a jolt in the right direction.
I just don’t get the “poor Carson” arguement. Our own accounts have been delayed umpteen times, this is Carsons fault. He has delayed his own trial 3/4 times; Carsons fault.
I’m eternally grateful for Wembley; even if we ended up in the conferrence I wouldn’t swap that day for anything. However due to “alleged” past dealings, not having the funds initially to buy the club he is ruining this club and the buck stops with him
KRO
James, you miss the point.
Carson gets rousted for spending money willy nilly. We were stable under the former board – people rousted them for being “unambitious”.
Carson gets rousted for not saying anything. The former board got it for saying too much.
Swings and roundabouts innit? Good and bad – and you have to see that all owners are a mixture of the two.
As for Fry – signed some great players… and some utter crap.
It’s not a case of “Poor Carson”. It’s a case of people using this court case as a reason to hate him when he has done good for us.
Also, please explain not having the funds initially to buy the club he is ruining this club?
As I recall the only downside of that was Bruce went… having lost was it seven on the spin moaning he couldn’t get a new deal?
And if you’re going to use things like past indiscretions for moaning at owners… Sullivan did prison time for living off immoral earnings. Not the best of crimes to be done for, is it?
With respect Al I don’t think I am missing the point.
Appreciate the previous board loved the sound of their own voice and at times some shocking stories; Brady slating the players in The Sun, Sullivan citing Maradona as a transfer target. But Carson has said nothing for over 12 months; if innocent then I’d expect at least a token gesture.
I do agree re swings and roundabouts but if the club have to sell again in Jan, this puts us in a tough spot.
I’ve never hated Carson, nor would I use the court case as extra ammo. But his silence doesn’t fill me with confidence.
His lack of funds to begin with were a huge concern; a bridging loan was needed? Our previous board raised the asking price and Carson paid way over the odds. Surely if he had any business acumen ( granted he has 100 times more than me) he would have had some contingency for when things go bad – ie relegation.
Whilst Sullivan is not exactly whiter than white I know which chairman I’d rather have….
KRO
if you think throwing money about ( who’s is debateable ) is ok and winning people ??? then sobeit – but I feel that what the barber has done has put the club I have supported for 50 years in a very perilous position !!!!!!!! and lets hope the final outcome is what we all are praying for
Be honest Tamuff – did you moan when we signed Zigic?
Did you complain when we signed Hleb?
Did you back attempts to sign Pavlyuchenko for £12mil?
Did anyone say “hold up a mo, this could bankrupt us in a few years if we’re not careful?”
Whilst times aren’t great I don’t think it’s like 1991 when we were what, an hour from liquidation? The club has virtually no debt barring money owed to Carson, it’s run on tight lines – it’s an attractive proposition at the right price. Whilst the next month, few months, maybe even year or two could be painful they’re not going to be as bad as it has been in the past I’m sure.
tam,; Do you not remember the state we were in when the Kumars were in charge, ??.
I hope some of you will apologise to CY if he is innocent. Do you think that we would be in this position if he had not been arrested? Most business people do all they can to limit the amount of tax they pay, and I am starting to suspect that this is what it boils down to. I think he has upset the wrong person somewhere along the line too.
As fro Barry Fry buying some good players (and a lot of crap) the law of averages suggest that if you throw enough balls in the air you will catch some!!!
I will eat a huge slice of humble pie if CY is found innocent!
How can you not give Fry any credit, unless you were spoilt in the 70’s etc, my generation had the following
Gary Pendrey
Terry Cooper
Dave Mckay
Lou Macari
Fry came along and gave us an increase in attendances ( 25k plus for a mickey mouse cup game), promotion ( relegation soon followed) but it was exciting and we saw the likes of Daish, Dominguez Bennett et al. Granted we had the pain of watching with Miguel De Souza etc but it was 10 times better than the tripe served up under the previous managers. My hero’s were Vince Overson & Nigel Gleghorn ffs. I caught the buzz under Fry and he gave Francis a platform to build on.
KRO
So the ‘new’ judge has decided to give the prosecution a setback in not recognising their case is wholly about money laundering! Well, it certainly helps the defense and it can be seen that from this surprising ruling, Caron’s defense case suddenly takes a different direction. So what has happened to the original judge, and the entire country of HK being against him …until now? If this is now a tax case, then PP still has his hands full, but CY still needs to sell up quick sharp …that much still stands, and I hope they both dont think they can put us on the back burner for a while. CY’s legal mess has caused the club to suffer, whichever way its looked at. Arogance can only go so far before it begins to sounds like ‘banker’.
Sell up and go …simple.
I wasnt being overly negative on Fry, and I remember all those players well. He did buy and sell a lot of players though!!
80 in 3 years – you might have a point!
oldbluenose YES I do remeber them days – being one of the 6000 on the kop BUT this man has and most probly will take us to them depths again – and almajir I always had doubts about the Barber simply because of the links to Reading and the Vile – Also Al if we are such an attractive proposition then how come we aint seeing billionaire after billionair outbidding each other ??? Dont believe that bullshit about Hong Kong groups they are just trying to raise the Paladini stake !!!!! And James I also have missed this Poor Carson shite – I do remember Peter Pan taking the Piss in Madeira I am a very very concerned fan who is terrified of ghosts ie Pompey Cov etc etc
Re the HK consortiums… it might not be the BS you think.
Do you really believe that PP would lie to the HKSE????
Yes I do
I think that given what has already taken place with BIHL, there is no chance on earth he would do so, especially with the highlight on CY at the moment. It would be professional suicide.
I too think Carson does care about Blues but his complete lack of understanding to running a football club has caught up with him. He fell into a barrels of tits and came up sucking his thumb.
I can understand everyones frustrations at this sorry mess we find ourselves in, but won’t have its his fault. I’m sure he didn’t ask to be arrest, or get his assets frozen, or be bound to his home (if it is his!!)
If his assets were unfrozen tomorrow and he sent money to blues to buy players, sure the club financially until his trial was over (if it ever is) would people still have such hatred for him.
We won the cup and had a European adventure none of us ever thought possible. In my life time I always thought playoffs and derby games were the best is was going to get, he had a helping hand in making thousands of us happier than we ever thought possible watching the Blues at Wembley didn’t he?
As I said before, if he hadnt been arrested, do people sill think we would be in the mess we are in?? I dont.
I totally agree with this. His plan to promote the club in HK/China has been thwarted only by the arrest, and all that’s followed.
Who knows what CY would have achieved.
BUT he was arrested !!!!!! and by this act has plunged OUR club into turmoil !!!!! and the sorry state will continue till he has gone and good riddance
he was arrested, but we dont know if he is guilty yet….. so why do most people direct their vitreol to Carson? It may be that the HK authorities are to blame for our mess, we just dont know yet……
Think people are moving away from the main issue.
We should all focus our efforts on how we can get PP to keep us informed and what can we do if he decides to not to.
The clock is ticking and the fans appear to be helpless but there must be something we can do?
PP is bound by the rules of the stock exchange!
I realise this but he could a progress report without disclosing the details or breaching the legal restrictions.The silence is creating the rumours and frustrations and in some cases anger.
PP is more than capable of making this type of statement.
Art,; Your point is very valid indeed, !!!.
Thanks,
Like many fellow supporters I’m frustrated ,angry and worried.
The blues supporters deserve better
Does anyone else think that the supporters trust could be doing something?
Don’t get me wrong, I know if Pannu wants to say nothing, he’ll do just that, but surely they must be as worried as the rest of us?
Ahem
http://www.bluestrust.org/2012/11/takeover-statement/
Thanks for almajir,; I also was wondering what the Trust were thinking, [ doing ], Got my answer, !!.
All you ever have to do is ask them, and I’m sure they would tell you.
I am planning an interview with their new board to ask them what they’re doing.
Almajir;, I await hearing of their response, Hoping that they have indeed opened channels with staff at St, Andrews, !!.
Did you have time to check up on that list of players out of contract at seasons end, ?.
Frankly, no. I’ve been snowed under the past few days. It’s on my list.
There you go “oldbluenose,” tells you everything you need to know.
Just have a look at the current market value of our squad, makes interesting reading lol.
I’m sorry, forgot to add the link
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/birmingham-city/kader/verein_337.html
Thanks for the link.
Al, in that South China Morning Post article it says the following:
“Yeung based his application on the grounds that he had only recently secured the funds to pay his legal fees. All his assets were frozen by a court-ordered injunction that was imposed soon after his arrest in June last year.”
Where, I wonder, did he get his cash for the legal fees if his assets were frozen? Do you think Pannu has given some change from down the back of the settee?
Don’t quote me but I’m certain I read somewhere 600k was borrowed/given to Carson by friends, but that still isn’t enough.
Something like that – about £800k from friends and well-wishers.
Nothing from BCFC though – I do have contacts there and if something like that happened, believe me I’d write something about it.
Wish I had “friends” like that…
Louise;, That is an eye-opener, ?. Where did you find that site, ?.
I am a little scepticle about it, as it quotes players that are not actually ours,– but — if it is just giving possible transfer values of these guys anyway, ?. — back to my first line, — Chuckle,!!.
I came across it when I was looking up info on Zigic’s contract, disagreement with a fellow fan.
The worrying thing for me is the amount of players out of contract next season. Will they be sold before they can be released free? Also our star players are only worth more in our eyes. If we need the money then they’ll go for whatever’s on the table.
I’d take the values with a pinch of salt like you say. But if Carson did call his loan in then we’d have to sell the whole squad and the loan players to raise £12.5 mil lol!
What every dreamer investor needs is a Chairman or CEO with SPECIFIC knowledge of the field.The individual should also have had great experience in the subject and contacts gained over the years.It is sad for CY that he did not appoint such an individual.He needed someone to ride shotgun who had immense knowledge of the English game and could have kept his feet well planted and ensured that we came out on the right side of any deals or skirmishes.I am actualy beginning to feel quite sorry for Carsen.It could have been so different.
I thought that was why he appointed Steve McManaman?
Is this the point where I note that Steve McManaman was a director of Grandtop before Carson was?
almajir says:
November 29, 2012 at 4:41 pm
Re the HK consortiums… it might not be the BS you think.
Do you know something about who these HK groups are? or were you saying it might be some other kind of BS?
Hi, Been reading through the thread and whilst I enjoy your debate some of the replys are nothing short of ludicrous. First of all even Hong Kong would not operate at kangaroo court regime so to suggest there are NO charges yet beggars belief. Secondly could 19 witnesses and 50+ boxes of archive folders not be suggesting that there are in fact struggling with the evidence, if it was as cut and dry as they say??? And finally PP no being involved in his defence, of course he must be advising his close friend and neighbour. Ex HK police and qualified defence lawyer, his influence is not going to be as effective if he was named in his defence team, plus it is likely he will be called as a defence witness. Just a few points to digest.
I love how Jeff Au is in that video link!