What Now?

Yesterday’s news that Carson will not stand trial until the end of November 2012 hasn’t gone down well with many Blues fans – which is understandable. Reading through the comments left on here the big question on many fan’s lips is what happens now. Here’s my take on the situation.

I have to agree with the fans who said that this further delay is bad news. With the trial not starting until 28 November and the prosecution alone needing at least fifteen days to go through evidence etc it’s going to be 2013 before a verdict is reached – another year plus of uncertainty and of rumour and speculation. For all we know Carson won’t be connected with Blues when this rolls around, but for the time being it’s not good.

There has been a lot of talk of administration; rumours flying around in Braga and lots of people online predicting the end of the world – well, Carson’s tenure as the head honcho at Blues at least. I mentioned in the comments yesterday that I don’t think it will happen that soon; I think Blues will limp through until the winter transfer window at a minimum. Once Blues have an idea of transfer money in, wages cut and whatnot, I think they money men will know if we can continue until the end of the season or if the administrator needs to be called in.

One of the key problems we have with Blues is that it seems nobody outside Carson’s inner circle actually know how much money we owe to who – and as such, I can understand why Blues fans want an insolvency practitioner to come in and unravel things and sort it out. However, administration is painful – not only in the sense of losing ten points in the league and players on the pitch, but for the staff working at the club. I know a fair few people who work at Blues and the last thing I’d personally wish on them is the threat of them losing their jobs to redundancy.

One of the chief creditors that I do know about is Carson himself; he’s put in £16million in directors loans and BCFC going into administration would mean him pretty much losing everything – he’s already in danger of losing his house as he put it up for collateral on a business loan for Blues and I think losing his investment completely in Blues would be very harsh on him. As much as some fans hate Carson, I think they’re being unfair – is it his fault he spent big on transfers and wages only for the team not to perform on the pitch? I know some people don’t think he spent much, but you only have to look at Zigic’s weekly wage (along with Ben Foster, Alex Hleb, David Bentley, Obafemi Martins etc) to see where our money went last year.

The most important thing now is communication; with definite dates of when Carson is to be in court the club’s management need to tell us what they’re going to do; how they’re going to plan for the next twelve months without Carson’s money. In my opinion it’s also time for the BIHL board to make decisions on how they’re going to continue to operate considering Carson’s position. Unfortunately I don’t think that’s going to happen, and as fans we’re going to continue groping in the dark until change is forced upon the board. It’s not a great situation to be in.

Tags: BIH, Carson Yeung, China, HK, Peter Pannu

JohnR says:

December 9, 2011 at 9:15 am

You make a very good point about BIHL. Yeung is a minority shareholder with, I think, 26%. That means the remaining sherholders have approx 74% of the shares between them. We all focus on Yeung but what are the other shareholders doing. Their assets are not frozen.

I’ve said it many times before, we need some transparency, but knowing how secretive the Chinese are I doubt we’ll get it.

December 9, 2011 at 9:19 am

I’ve just seen that someone else made the same comment on yesterday’s blog. At least two of us are thinking along the same lines.

Bluemat says:

December 9, 2011 at 9:44 am

Firstly i think we all look to Carson has he is the only one that has really pushed himself forward from the group that base themselves out of Hong Kong/China, there maybe 78% of other investors but truthfully there not really known. I think that the money men will know already whether the club will remain beyond January or not, it will be based on what money we can get for certain players. But still they should already know the figures required. Unfortunately Birmingham will have to cut their coth accordingly (as a business) to try and see themselves through the bad financial state, i.e. look at more part time/flexi staff and matchday staff as opposed to 9-5 full time staff. Other companies have to do this and staff their business to the required need of the business. For me Carson did put alot into Birmingham and if he looses everything then unfortunately he only has himself to blame, he trusted mcleish with the money and he let him spend it. At the time we may say that there was little complaint from the fans but there clearly was a poor relationship between mcleish and yeung +co in the first instance, the involvement of sammy yu on the training ground was a big turning point. Yeung gambled on a business he knew nothing about, he was out thought by sullivan and out manouvered by other people withing the football industry, they played on his lack of football knowledge, the same applies to pannu. (Spurs took us for a ride on more the one player). The club has failed due to not getting a football man in that has the nous to run the club, getting a football person in may have been the soundest financial investment yeung could have made. Maybe we should of saw the writing on the wall when Michael Dunford disappeared without a word. Tough times ahead KRO!!

parkp says:

December 9, 2011 at 10:07 am

Its a mess. All the shareholders in BIHL just have interest in the company and not Birmingham city. Whether or not they wrestle control from yeung is a matter for them and their interests. Who would have thought, in their wildest dreams, when we lifted the League cup at wembley back in feb, this mess was just around the corner?

Dirty Bertie says:

December 9, 2011 at 10:42 am

Don’t worry lads, Ridsdale will get round to us eventually.
(How do you get smiley/angry faces on here??)

Masaccio says:

December 9, 2011 at 10:43 am

I don’t care if we play in the conference, we’re still the blues and that’s all that counts.

Dino Tiltoni says:

December 9, 2011 at 10:57 am

All the above is true, pretty much. Ignorance and ineptitude has reigned and we’ll have to get used to a lower level of ambition. At the start of the season a mid table finish looked like something to aim at and that remains. Hopefully Zigic will move on and Foster sold so that we can financially limp through to the end of season playing some exciting football. Administration will bring about a relegation battle but that might attract a new owner or enable a supporters’ trust to be more influential. The most valuable thing the club has is us, its fans. It’s a well supported and much loved club and that’s it main selling point. The sooner we can move on and detach ourselves from BIHL the better.

Warley Blue says:

December 9, 2011 at 11:59 am

I agree with a lot of the above. I wasn’t happy about the entire Yeung/BIHL thing from the start, although it was indeed time for Gold, Sullivan etc. to move on. Their promise of leaving the club is safe hands was an empty one; they trousered the over-inflated offer and made a sharp exit.

It’s true, Carson *has* put a lot of money into the club, but I think he has been shockingly naive and it looks as though his business model for the club (if he had one) is way off the mark. Owners come and go, but the fans remain and we have to suffer the consequences of it.

AR says:

December 9, 2011 at 2:27 pm

Was there,or is there any information at all why Michael Dunford left after such a short time? It would probably throw some light on why we are now in the situation we are now in. Has anyone any information on it?

almajir says:

December 9, 2011 at 2:28 pm

My understanding is that Pannu et al felt that they could do the job as well as Mr Dunford could, and thus Mr Dunford was superfluous.

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Northfield says:

December 9, 2011 at 5:05 pm

Yea we all hated sullivan and gold in the end with there limited ambitions and daylight robbery tactics with fans! Then we get someone who wants to put money in and do his best but players and staff let him down so he loses everything and so does the business (blues) i actually feel sorry for carson having pumped so much in but being let down by ginger etc. Thanks for the cup carson and thanks for sanctioning 60k a week wages carson thanks for tapping barca for hleb carson, thanks for so much. Shame the people you entrused with your limited money f***ed you over so badly. Kro

chris says:

December 9, 2011 at 5:30 pm

feel sorry for yeung not on your nelly, he paid 40 mill too much for the club in the first place which he could have invested in several parts of the club / team.
he was worth about 200 to 300 million as far as i could tell at the time he took the reins, but that didn’t mean he had cash to invest and that proved correct as he had to raise loans to invest in the team, that was a slippery road to ruin especially when running a cash hungry business like a prem football team.
even learner and golds sully both worth over a billion at the time struggled to invest in their teams so how the hell was someone worth 20% of their wealth going to run a similar club, it was never going to work.
we need bih directors who ow the majority of the company to start running the company instead of letting it go to ruin, as that is what will happen unless they are pro-active like trading the shares again, if they don’t do something they will lose their money as well.

December 9, 2011 at 6:17 pm

I do agree with the above, but i only have some sorrow because i believe he almost like a fan trying to live the dream but it clearly never worked. He got ripped off big time by the cardiff fan sully and yes you got to say what a terrible business man or mens the chinese have turned out to be, but he did try the dream, he put more money in than the previous regime ever did it just back fired. Kro

Violent Pacifist says:

December 9, 2011 at 7:56 pm

Who owns the club?

Who owns the parent company BIH?

Minimum information required as a fan.

Consortiums, Russian billionaires and buy outs are all bullshit.

Follow the money for the answers.

comment edited

Boy from Oz says:

December 10, 2011 at 12:07 pm

I smell a conspiracy,
Secret mens business, no statements from anywhere within the club. Someone knows something. I would have thought the FA would be ordering the club directors to provide a business plan for current and future operating.
We might have to start scouring the non league clubs for some replacements for the players that will be sold in January. i.e. Zigic, Foster, Beau, Ridgewell, Curtis, Burke, Redmond and Butland.

joe king says:

December 10, 2011 at 12:45 pm

Boy from Oz, glad to see your’e full of optimism for the future.
I agree with most of the above valid comments and would love to see Mr Pannu come out with a statment about the clubs future as he understands it. He must have had enough contact with BIH to know their plans for the club.

Denis Thwaites says:

December 13, 2011 at 1:50 pm

There was a documentary shown on TV a few months ago which indicated that some English football clubs with Premier league potential had been prostituted around the world as being a good investment which could be doubled in value in a year if money was thrown at it to improve the team.

My guess is that this is how the CY regime evolved and it has nothing to do with the owner wanting to live the dream. As pointed out not having the necessary readies to take full ownership when the financial bubble burst a few years ago was a sure sign of what was to come. Ok CY and et al may have paid over the odds but the previous regime were always going to squeeze every drop they could out of any new owner before they would leave for the Irons. Also paying over the odds on wages is part and parcel of football in the premier league but you have to have a business model which stands up if things go wrong. If nothing else the previous regime had one!

Given that the financial accounts have been delayed until the end of next month and the CY case is more than a year away before it will get resolved then we probably need to prepare for the worst next year. Whatever the situation, this is the club we support and we have to al KRO