Often Partisan

Pannu Interview: What Happens Now?

There has been a lot of comment online about Peter Pannu’s interview with Colin Tattum of the Birmingham Mail and Tom Ross of Free Radio. Whilst I don’t want to go into the ins and outs of the interview I wanted to share my thoughts about where Blues go from here and what I think will happen. As always, these are my thoughts and my thoughts alone – most of it is speculation except where I have cited facts and should be treated as such.

The big thing for me is that I’m now convinced that we will not see a takeover before the end of the season. I always thought the key to Paladini’s bid was to get in before the end of January, get some players in and try to push on second half of the season. That’s not going to happen now – I think it’s now physically impossible to sort anything before the end of January (particularly as Hong Kong shuts for three days in the middle of it due to the Chinese New Year celebrations). I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Italians pull out for now as the opportunity that seemed to present itself in the last two months has now evaporated.

One of the big things that intrigued me was Peter Pannu saying that he didn’t know (and needed to find out) whether the accounts for BIH needed to produced and up to date to allow the sale to go through. I was always of the belief that they weren’t but I’m now sufficiently interested to make the same sort of investigations myself – which I will of course share the results of. However, a theory I’ve been idly kicking around since the start of this month has now taken more prominence in my mind and I’m starting to wonder if we will see a takeover at all.

I will admit that at this moment it’s still only a theory and most people I’ve spoken to don’t think it will happen but I think there is a chance that rather than a company buying BCFC from BIH we will see an investor or investors put money into BIH and take over running the company. Outside investment would see the company continue functioning and potentially money coming into BCFC from Hong Kong again and would allow Carson to continue in his position as major shareholder. If he then lost his criminal court case then whilst he wouldn’t be able to pass the Football League Owners and Directors test he could make himself exempt from that by a)resigning from both boards and b) reducing his shareholding to 9.9% or lower. Whilst there would be questions with respect to if Carson was using his son Ryan (on the BCFC board) and potentially his brother-in-law Ma Shui Cheong as proxies I believe it would be hard for the Football League to prove conclusively.

There is precedent for this happening; last year Carson drew investment from Mainland China into his newspaper Sing Pao, in which he still remains the largest shareholder (via his Cayman Islands based company Billion Wealth Ltd) although he has no control over whatsoever.  Interestingly the managing director of Sing Pao is new BIH board member Mr Ma.

I don’t think this would go down well with the majority of Blues fans and it’s that reason that most people I have spoken to have discounted this as a plausible scenario. However, whilst I know that Pannu is aware of the antipathy towards the HK-based owners from the fans it’s worth bearing in mind that Pannu is only an employee of Carson’s – and one wonders if Carson will take the same view as Pannu will.

In the meantime we have to face the here and now. Pannu has confirmed that the club will in all likelihood have to look at selling a player to help deal with cashflow issues. It’s not the best situation to be in but it’s one I’ve expected for a long time and have mentioned on here often enough. I am in agreement with Pannu’s last words in the interview – the club needs us, the supporters – and in the end when we go to a match we’re supporting the team, not the board. It’s all we can do at the moment as the most imperative thing right now is that the club doesn’t get relegated and I believe as fans we have the power to help push the team forwards to get the points needed to stay up. It shouldn’t be like that – I have no doubt in my mind we’re underperforming as a team but it’s the situation we are in and what we have to deal with. I know I’ve seen people saying this is the worst it’s ever been, but it’s not – the late 80’s and early 90’s saw us in a similar situation but what differed from then is that we’ve been spoilt of late. As Tim Booth of James sang (and as I was reminded by desertbootboy on SHA)

If I hadn’t seen such riches I could live with being poor

Talking Points sponsored by John Hicken Industrial roofing and cladding materials

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132 Responses to “Pannu Interview: What Happens Now?”

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    Spot on.

    First we need to fill the ground, then stop the moaning, then back the team and the manager.

    As fans that’s all we can do.

    KRO

    • Thongs says:

      Great sentiment, unfortunately the players are garbage, the manager unbackable and there are better things to do on matchdays.

      enjoy your delusion though.

      • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

        Thongy make your mind up mate.

        You’ve jacked remember? You said so on here.

        Or was that more of yer bollox?

        You’ll be at scum park before too long.

    • alexjhurley says:

      Totally right Paul. An increasing percentage of our fans are a disgrace and should f/o down to aston. Too much moaning because were not reaching the unreasonably high expectations these muppetts aspire to. The sooner they realise that were one of about 30 clubs existing on gates in the region of 20000 competing for the 10 or so available prem places the better. Get down stans, get behind the team.

  • Taz says:

    Yet another thought provoking article. I tend to agree with you in that, I also doubt if there will be a takeover. To be honest, I don’t think it would be such a bad thing if CY is cleared of all charges and comes back to take over the helm and produce some investment.

    If he is cleared, I think he will feel he has got a lot to prove. He still won’t relish the thought of losing face and he most certainly won’t willingly lose £40M+ on his investment just to please people who (financially) have little to lose in comparison.

    Even at this stage of the game, I still believe that a fully functional Yeung is a much better scenario than Paladini. If CY does come back, I feel sure he will want to rebuild the club, at least, to Premier League status before he leaves.

    • carlos says:

      Yeung hasn’t got any money. He initially paid Sully and Gold £15 m for 29% of Blues. No one seems to know where he made his money or how much he is worth, but we do know he is accused of money laundering in HK and is up in court in March. He raised the other £57m by selling shares ie other people paid S & G the rest. I believe this was underwritten by Pauline Wong, who makes her money through casinos. He had to remortgage his house (how many genuine business men would do this !) to give Blues some working capital. Even before his arrest he could not support Blues and did not have the contacts/nouse to do it anyway.

      • KeepRightcroydOn says:

        Couldn’t agree more.
        I really can’t understand why so many people, including reputable journalists so not seem to be in the least bit suspicious about CY’s background and how he made his fortune (if indeed he did – he may be just surviving off credit, moving funds around, re-negotiating loans etc, for all we know). My point is that there has been zero transparency about him, his past and currently as we all know BIH accounts are being supressed. Incidentally I don’t consider Paladini is transparent either. It’s pretty clear he does not have the financial means to buy the club, and is relying on other people who remain anonymous, which should make us suspicious.

        I’m inclined to agree with Almajir’s conclusions that there is a strong likelihood that CY (or BIH) could still be in charge at the end of the season. Where I disagree is that I am not sure that CY actually has the club’s interests at heart. It’s his plaything which he wants to hang into at any cost, and if it means selling players one by one to do so, he will. He is slowly strangling the club.

  • Emily says:

    It’s like the song goes “we don’t care about Carson ….. All we care about is bcfc!” In a couple of weeks time we could be in a real relegation dog fight and winning our home games will get us through it, people staying away is loosing us revenue and we will loose what decent players we have. People need to grip the fact that it could really happen and we could be a League One club in May. Booing ur player before he’s had a chance to make a mistake? Is not gunna make him wanna play any better or get him motivated. It’s gunna be a nervy time not really looking forward to it I think a lot of fans attitudes need to change and refocus that emotion towards Clark and the board on helping their team stay in the second teir of English Football .

    • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

      Well said Em.

      Day to day operating costs would be more easier met if our loyal wembley season ticket holders and our internet warrior crews actually went to a game. Fill the ground, support your club. Easy.

      • Carl says:

        A few thousand more on the gate doesn’t run a football club – if that includes signing players on long term contracts and the all the other absurd costs associated with getting the club back in the Prem’, and staying there.

        Although I agree it would be nice not to have embarrassingly low crowds.

  • Carson Yeung says:

    Buy the ticket !

  • skareggae72 says:

    Lets hope when Pannu sells the crown jewels he puts away a bit of money to sign the likes off Hall & Caddis,we cannot just keep selling.
    The writing has been on the wall for a long time,financial figures unsubmitted,missing sponsorship money,things they can and cannot say to various people,legal technicalities,repossesion,possible administration,failed takeovers and more,the only thing that has made the last few weeks bearable is the spectacular mediocrity at Villa.
    More luck in 2013????

  • Chris Smith says:

    just a thought, if a chinese/hk takeover happened could it be possibly done by just changing the board at bihl.

  • andy says:

    Iv given up, absoloutely sick to the back teeth of the whole thing. The club is a mess and Lee Clark should be applauded if he keeps Birmingham in the championship this season.

  • bluenose 11 says:

    im starting to think now that we know we need to sell butland to stay afloat that maybe we should sell redmond as well to use as reinvestment, i realise i may get shot down for this but its bodies we need experienced bodies so that we can at least stay in this division. its a sad day
    kro

  • JK1875 says:

    Pannu and Yeung can’t sell because then the new owners would have access to the “accounts” and would discover the massive deliberate fraud that this bunch of liars, gangsters and thieves have perpetrated,

    • Blue in Spain says:

      I assume you’ve informed the police? Thought not… Faceless Internet Warrior!

      • Art Watson says:

        What evidence do you have which would prove they haven’t?

        • Blue in Spain says:

          So it’s ok to make false accusations, and you then have to prove your innocent, great justice system Art. I assume you wouldn’t want to be called friend of Jimmy Saville with absolutely no evidence, so stop being ridiculous!

          • Art Watson says:

            Blue in Spain.

            You obviously don’t have any evidence so you resort to personal attacks.

            Why contribution do you make to the club apart from criticise those who have ambition and who happen to constructively disagree with your view.

            How many emails or phone calls have you made to Pannu to voice your concerns even though like me you are an ex-pat I assume?

          • Chris Smith says:

            That’s not a personal attack Art. The basis of the argument was evidence, wether it be proving you to be a friend of a know paedophile or someone else of fraud/embezzelment/false accounting/what not. It’s like the guy who phoned in WM saying Pannu wasn’t coming to the games after the last home game. I know that PP was at the last home game as he was sitting next to Mike Wiseman in the directors box, easily viewable from block 30. The back two rows regularly look to see who’s in (Carrot, Delia Smith, GM and other were all spotted though GP has only been to two iirc). Evidently the caller doesn’t bother to check facts before phoning.

        • Mickey07 says:

          Yeung has been lifted on money laundering charges,vico apparently done a runner with the kit money,accounts go missing,and pannu don’t know his arse from his elbow what more evidence do you need that they are up to no good in running this club.

        • James Black says:

          Art, What evidence do you have that says they have? None. So easy to speak without knowing.

    • bluenose 11 says:

      i would be very careful what alligations you make unless you can prove them mr pannu loves a court case
      kro

  • James Hunt says:

    Chinese New Year is in February, not the middle of January!!

    As you keep saying, your name is above door, so up to you eh?

  • RUPERT says:

    He appears to live in a strange world away from reality does Mr yeung. There will be no takeover as I predicted and mark my words this team is relegation waiting to happen, if Pannu sells Butland and a couple of others, (I dont believe King is injured but already on his way, remember scott danns injury ?) I stand to be correected on that one. He has virtually signed us a relegation ticket, after watching us at Bolton I realise how poor and lacking in confidence this team are.

    I dont know how many season tickets he will hope to sell next season?

  • Berkshire Blue says:

    A few observations
    1. I find it concerning that we don’t seem to know whether or not the BIH accounts need to be up to date to enable a sale.
    2. I think the scenario you describe is a possibility but unlikely – CY/PP have been looking for an investor for sometime now and any investment looks a lot less attractive than it did 18 months back. I struggle to believe anyone would want to invest in BIH given its history without taking control.
    3. It’s worth reminding ourselves what’s for sale now. A club in the lower reaches of the Championship with £20m debt and a cash flow reducing by at least £8m p.a. next year. The thing that most worries me is the playing staff – youngsters plus a number of over 30s with many players being out of contract next year. We have very few players on our books in the 25-27 age range who are the bedrock of most teams. The championship is a very competitive league and I’m struggling to see us being up there in the promotion mix for several years at the current rate.
    4. I struggle to see anyone paying £40m for the above. The best I think we can hope for is survival this season and hopefully a takeover – probably at Paladini thpe prices -before next season to start building the playing side again.
    5. Ahead of that the only thing we can do is support the team and help them to stay up

  • GBBlue says:

    Hopefully as we approach the end game in 2013 we might get sone answers. Who actually is CY and where did his money come from? who else really owns BIHL and why have the larger shareholders remained anonymous? how bad are all the unreported years of accounts? My main question (which may forever remain unanswered) is why oh why did BIHL and ultimately CY buy us. In football it seems you buy a club because of a either a history of supporting that club i.e Dave Whelan, as a rich status symbol i.e. Abromovich or to make money in the medium/long term i.e Sullivan. CY didnt fit any of these, he certainly didnt have the personal wealth required to bankroll a PL team. Just what were his motives??

  • Quokkasskip says:

    Ok, building on this theory. CY thinking maybe

    Plan A, get some mug to pay £40m for Bcfc and run to the hills.

    Plan B, suck as much money out as possible before going into administration and then running into the hills, still moaning about player wages.

    Unfortunately no one sane who is going to invest tens of millions will do so without seeing the parent company accounts, so plan A is looking v unlikely.

  • Art Watson says:

    Almajir,

    How do we know if money raised from transfers will actually go towards the running costs of the club?Most of the transfers go through under the “undisclosed fee “arrangements.

    I just do not believe that all the money generated from player transfers will be solely used to prop up the club.

    Creative accountancy comes to mind!!

    • Blue in Spain says:

      Another internet warrior, I bet you never accused Pannu of that in your emails, or do you think you’re untouchable in Cyprus?

    • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

      Art seeing as you have proudly boasted on here how Blues will never get another penny off you whilst the present regime are in charge can’t you see that that makes you part of the problem? We are selling players due to cash flow and your great idea is to stop contributing.

      The other side of that coin is that some of those who do contribute think it gives em the right to moan, gripe and whinge all through the games spoiling it for eveybody else. In the main I can’t stand our fans anymore and talking to some veteran faces at Bolton I’m not the only one.

      • Ali Duncan says:

        Agreed – so much negativity does spoil it for me – that is why it’s so encouraging that we now have Forza Blues who sing their hearts out for the whole game and get behind the team.

        Personally I don’t much look forward to home games as much now due to the poison from the stands and an almost half empty stadium. Love the away games as its loyal hardcore Blues. Bring on Huddersfield & Burnley (if both us and them lose in the cup that is)

        • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

          I am seriously considering relocating my seat to nearby Forza next season its just they don’t look normal that puts me off.

          They hark back to a brighter time when we had better fans who knew we were shite but did their best to back the team.

          This current crop trying to convince me booing is ok and not going is ok make me wanna puke.

          • Ali Duncan says:

            Haha. They’re normal enough. I went in with them for Bristol City and it was great. Super friendly, screaming your lungs out for the lads and doing the conga. Great laugh and well recommended. I expect their numbers grow in the next season as people want that old school football experience again.

      • Art Watson says:

        Paul,
        I would willingly continue to financially support the Blues in which ever way I can but I just do not trust Pannu and the board to do what’s right for the club.If I thought that every penny paid in would go to ensure the survival of our club I would gladly spend more of my money to help the cause.At the moment money is being put into a bucket with a big hole in the bottom.As for supporter loyalty and let’s all get behind the team-lets see how much loyalty the players ,who’s contracts are up for renewal ,will show at the end of the season-it will be more like rats leaving a sinking ship.

        Finally and let me be frank-please do not suggest that our current issues are related to lack of support as clearly the problems we have are down to bad management at board level and a manager who is out of his depth.Its not the supporters fault it’s the fault of those in charge of the club.

        Spend your money if you wish but the only way I can protest against these clowns is to keep my money in my pocket as I will until they all clear off.

  • chudlt says:

    Pannu’s plan A seems to be to sell the best players this month(Jan) to keep the club afloat. But for how long? At best until the end of the season.
    Then with no more players to sell in the summer and the loan players returned to their clubs, what will we have left?
    If we remain in the Championship which seems unlikely (I am writing this after attending the game at Bolton when we were humiliated in the final 10 minutes) then we will be facing a third season in the lower division with no hope of pushing for promotion.
    If relegated to League One we will not have a squad capable of pushing for a return to the Championship. This coupled with loss of TV revenue and even lower attendances means the club will stagnate. We are following Portsmouth going into decline because we have a board who at the best are incompetent.

  • jassyblue80 says:

    No need to do your own research now pal http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/birmingham-city-takeover-prospects-are-hit-394240

    The accounts are delayed :'(

    I agree on all counts… I don’t think.we will be sold, I don’t think there are any serious buyers out there!!
    We as fans have a duty to get behind who ever pulls on the royal blue shirt! We can help lift the gloom our selves. There is nothing we can do about the offield anticts but we can help those left behind.

    I really think.as fans we have a duty to get down st Andrews (if you can, and can afford too) and support the team!

    Kro

  • Art Watson says:

    Don’t mention the R word-you’ll be accused of being negative instead of realistic.

  • Mark Y says:

    The fact is now that the club now are eminently less attractive to buy than they were a few months ago, with relegation rather than promotion being a more likely probability. The complexity of the accounting situation could also be a major issue now. It may be that the Charlie Chans bid fell through actually due to the general complexity of the situation created by the lack of accounting information. Further player sales which are necessary to keep us afloat will reduce the asset available to new investors. Any potential buyer is now going to sit and wait on the sidelines as (A) they would not be able to influence the club avoiding relegation or even investing sufficiently to put in a late push for the play offs. (B) to wait and see the outcome of the trial. One possible outcome of the trial that I would put forward as a possibility is that CY is found guilty but escapes prison by settling a substantial amount of unpaid tax on the transactions that went through his account. I say this because I understand that the money laundering charges are a misrepresentation of the actual charges issued and really the Hong Kong authorities are more concerned about tax evasion. In this situation CY’s assets would be unfrozen. As Blues would not be worth much by the end of the season following further player sales it may be that CY would invest further and retein ownwership. I agree that we could be facing a much longer period in the hands of CY. Things aren’t as bed as yet as the Wheldon/Kumar days but we are heading in the in same direction.

    • Tonytree says:

      The difference between now and the times of the Kumars is that if the club go into administration they are deducted 10 points. If this happened then the club would be relegated and then selling Butland and/or Redmond would be little use at all.
      With regards to a sale without up to date accounts, there is no chance. Anyone wanting to buy would expect a proper due diligence process and that would require up to date accounts. This actually excludes any potential takeover and leaves the club short of cash and staring down the barrel of the gun that is administration.
      The situation is perhaps worse than the days of the Kumars if you think of it.

  • StevieW says:

    My two trains of thought for a while have been either a takeover by new owners would be a whoosh bang event or that all these delaying tactics and awkwardness was so that CY could sort his life out and continue to be a part of BCFC assuming innocence. Now it looks like any buy out will miss the January window which, I think was key to any takeover, This has now given CY and PP the time to sort out their problems and they will attempt to just keep us afloat until the summer. Then who knows what will happen. So many scenarios that could happen its like asking who will win the Grand National.

  • Delboy says:

    Just a thought. At the moment it seems that the best way to help our club is to show our support for the team. The spin off from this would be to show any interested parties (or even some who at not interested yet) the potential of our great club.
    Why not organise a fill the ground match, exactly the opposite of a lets all stay away day in protest. This would show everyone that all we need is someone to light the blue touch paper and our club could come springing back to life. I wonder how this team would react to 30,000 blue noses singing keep right on at them.
    Anyone with good access to the media fancy taking this on.

    • stevie blue says:

      That is the best ideaI’ve ever read on this blog!!!

      • Ali Duncan says:

        Spot on. So, how do WE go about organising and sorting this? We can’t be apathetic. Al – with your strong ties would you be happy contacting the club first for them to promote the idea?

  • tony says:

    Why do people always try to put it on to the fans ?”We need to do this”,”we should do tha’t.!At the end of the day we didn’t pay over the odds for the club.We didn’t run the club into the ground.We weren’t the ones with no idea how to run a football club.Its easy to sit in another country and slag off every fan on here when you don’t go and support the team yourself.As for the rubbish” we need to fill the ground,stop moaning ” thats laughable.When was the last time the ground was full ?As for stop moaning,are we robots with no feelings.Anyone that moans about are predicament has every right to,i’d hate to be in a world where we all just go with the flow like mindless drones…i might as well go to the villa if i wanted that.

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    Couldn’t agree more Del the only problem is our so called fans prefer moaning on the net/in the pub/at work to actually going to a game. They hide their lack of support behind the negativity at the club. If we were top of the league we still wouldn’t fill the ground.

    What’s peed me off this morning is that PP with all those different job titles he holds is saying that
    the BIH accounts are likely to be needed to facilitate the sale of the club. Surely he should have known that? One of the consultants/auditors he uses surely mentioned it? Even to me with no financial training it’s pretty obvious that if some group is spending £30m they’re likely to be interested in the state of the parent company which exists only for Blues.

    • Bluehobba says:

      On that note Paul, accounts need to be done every year whether for a sale or not. Totally baffles me after all these years of their trading how they are allowed to continue to do so. Anyway, on to the Cardiff game. Lets enjoy it KRO

  • DoctorD says:

    What do people think about raising some cash by rebranding the stadium? I see Barclaycard have got naming rights at the NEC Group.

    http://www.birminghampost.net/news/west-midlands-news/2012/03/01/birmingham-national-indoor-arena-signs-sponsorship-deal-with-barclaycard-65233-30435582/

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    Lee Clark just tweeted

    ‘Our fans have been superb so far this season but now we need them more than ever to support these young lads and be our 12th man’

    The key word there is support.

  • GB Blue says:

    The only question I ever want to know the answer to is why did CY buy the Blues.

    There are three sorts of owner in football.

    1) The rich supporter who wants to spend their money on making the club they have loved better (Jack Walker, Dave Whelan)

    2) The mega rich person who buys a club as a status symbol and throws cash around with little concern about a monetary return they just crave success (Abromovich, Man City owners)

    3) Those who are looking to buy a club with a view to medium/long term return (Sullivan, all the US owners of PL clubs)

    Clearly CY wasn’t ever in the moneybags league to make 2) the reason. He had no affiliation to Birmingham City to make 1) a reason and he massively overpaid for us to ever expect a return on his investment therefore 3) is out of the window.

    Therefore I continue to scratch my head and wonder, who really is Carson Yeung and why did he buy us?!?

    • DoctorD says:

      In my view CY was/is a fantasist who thought he was option 2. To start with he thought it must have been easy (ninth place, a league cup) before it all went tits up.

      • GB Blue says:

        Thing is I could understand the fantasist thing but there are other investors from Hong Kong. Were they all fantasists? That Liu Xingcheng owns a massive part of BIHL and therefore BCFC and didn’t even make himself visable when were doing well. Who invests Millions and doesn’t bask in the glory when things go well?

        • DoctorD says:

          Yes, I think they all thought they were genuinely in the big time, rubbing sholders with the likes of Manchester United, Aresenal and Chelsea. Seriously, I can imagine they all got terribly carried away with the glory.

  • Euston 9.18 says:

    Can someone please explain to me,why BLUES have to sell players ??

    Reading the E`Mail page 45 …..

    BLUES plc’s next yearly accounts are set to be posted imminently.

    “THEY WILL SHOW A PROFIT” said Pannu.

    Can you go into administration when you show a PROFIT.
    And why can other football clubs spend millions while still in debt,but BLUES show a profit but have to sell ??

    • DoctorD says:

      Because, I guess, that would be a profit for the previous year the accounts refer to. The current situation is different. I still was intriguted in the interview when PP said he rejected six million for Butland in the summer “when the finances were OK”. I wonder what has changed in the meantime to make them “not OK”.

  • prewarblue says:

    Has any more been found out as to why Mr Dunsford quit in such a hurry,,,,,,why Sammy Yu left at speed,,,,,,,and who was in charge at St Andrews at the time?????,,,its not only Pannu and Yeung who are responsible for this mess,,,,,after all it wasnt them who channeled the Xtep money away from the club and is now keeping a very low profile after being forced to leave both boards

    • carlos says:

      I can’t understand how we haven’t heard any reports of the club suing Hui for that money, after all Pannu was very forthright in the press regarding BCFC money that Sullivan and Gold walked away with.

  • Sirharry1875 says:

    All we can do is get down there and get behind them.. This is the real Blues, crap owners, no money, talk of relegation, selling our best players, feeding off scraps like a last minute equaliser, the odd away win and laughing at the demise of our enemy.

    Anybody who thought it would be any different should have supported United or Liverpool as they did in my day. Most football fans suffer and we are no different. However the majority will never see their team beat one of europes elite and lift a major trophy at Wembley. We had our day and it’s painful to see that after finally delivering so many have turned their backs on the Club now that normal service has resumed.

    Get behind the Boys in Royal Blue. It’s all we can do.

    • Art Watson says:

      It could be so different under owners who are ambitious and who are prepared to invest serious money.Despite what some supporters say Blues are a big club and what’s going on at the moment is a disgrace.

      • Sirharry1875 says:

        Is that the “big” club that 1 week after winning a trophy still didn’t get a full house for a derby against the Albion? And then the next day less than 2000 turning up for a victory parade!

        We had as good a team as it gets when we went 12 games unbeaten and then won a trophy the season after and we still didn’t get full house’s.

        What’s serious money? Oil billionaires and sheikhs are never going to be interested in us. Supporters of Man City and Chelsea are football lottery winners.

        We are what we are, get used to it.

    • Ali Duncan says:

      I think that sums it up perfectly Sir Harry. I know so many jokers like that (most, sadly within my own family)

  • Paulo says:

    Ok, yes I agree that the whole Paladini ‘consortium’ bid didn’t go through (as yet, but prob never will) is down to the mystery behind Paladini. However, what Pannu hasn’t said, is exactly how plausable the other potential buyers were ..in Hong Kong. I do remember Paladini being led on, and the fans also being led on ..in having information that there were three parties interested. Then it subsequently went on to ‘investment’. What I pretty much thought all along anyway, was that there were no other buyers, it was always just the Paladini consortium. I just doubt that PP is simply an employee of CY.
    There is much to be said about what PP hasn’t said. I also find it quite interesting that since his promotion up to the senior board, his distance from BCFC must be noticed within the club also.
    I actually found his interview, combined with his other recent comments, very unsurprising and almost arrogant.
    My god, all we can do is sit back and watch PP be the voice of BIHL and BCFC and simply lead everyone on a wild goose chase, and whatever happens with the manager he personally handpicked, he takes no responsibility for.
    Yet, we all have to reside in the fact that since premier league relegation and CY being arrested, the only chance we had was CH and bouncing back. We didn’t, and some serious decisions have been made by people ‘in charge’ which have meant we are now sitting nervously at the bottom end of the table, with a very inconsistent team led by a manager who just hasn’t gelled with the fans.
    This isn’t the worst its been, but I find it the most humiliating. This is a mess that no one wants to take accountability for ..and somehow it feels like it’s getting personal.

  • RVH1T says:

    I am sure that you are correct but is probably only one of a number of scenarios that Peter Pannu is progressing. I suspect that it might have been the case that the Chan deal fell through becuase CY wanted to maintain some sort of presence with the club. what a mess! From another era, as the Beach Boys said about Blue noses “They grit their teeth, they don’t back down”.

  • solblue says:

    I really cannot see any takeover happening from any company/consortium or individual that would be a massively agreeable party. Surely with the lack of clarity over the club accounts, the unrealistic selling price expectations and the somewhat shady business practices of the curremt owners any business man with even a small amount of common sense and business acumen will now wait until the inevitable situation where we run out of assets to sell and slip into administration happens and then pick the club up for virtually no initial outlay.

    Ask yourself this question if you were a multi multi millianaire businessman even with yuor love for the club, would you be willing to buy from the club in the current siutation?

    Does anyone know for certian that we do not have a Rangers style tax bill lurking in the background that might prove a final nail?

    Does anyone ever see a situation where a fan group from a club in our situation actually launches a legal action against the FA over their handling of the related fit and proper person checks or are the FA excempt from any liability over this?

  • Blueboy88 says:

    You can rely on the Blues to be unpredicatable…

    So I am now strongly prediciting a 2-1 home win against the league leaders Cardiff tomorrow ,
    including the enevitable Jordon Mutch goal……

  • Blueboy88 says:

    Something to cheer us all up…It could catch on very easily..

    You have to admire the good-humoured round of applause started by a set of Albion fans during the eighth minute of their game at Old Trafford as a tribute to Chelsea’s recent scoreline against Villa.

  • solblue says:

    It is nice of our big club neighbours over the other side of the expressway to try to cheer us Blues fans up over the festive period, so far they have been my most enojoyable present, the gift that just keeps on giving!

    Is it too much to hope that Swansea could continue the great run?

  • stevie blue says:

    Like Almajir this my view is based on nothing more than hunches. I don’t think we’ll get taken over anytime soon, but we will eventually. Clubs such as Cardiff, Leicester (who went down to League 1) and Reading have attracted investment and so will Blues. In the meantime we may end up in the third tier just like the late eighties. Sorry Paul Carter, but this is a much bigger problem than filling the ground (your constant attacks on your fellow sopporters are in my opinion un called for). When Sullivan and Gold took over we were barely getting 7/8k. We went down in their first full season in charge because they had no plan (other than to spend as little as possible). And that’s the problem for me. Until someone takes over who has a long term strategy to develop the WHOLE club we’re never going to fulfill that massive potential. We’ll just lurch from one division to the next as we’ve always done and as clearly some of you think is the club’s destiny. No long term strategy = constant fire fighting. It’s no coincidence!

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    You’re right Stevie, I should be congratulating our fans for staying away, not putting a penny into the club and patting the moaners/whiners/whingers on the back.

    Lets all stay away or go down and create a poisonous atmosphere.

    • blaneh says:

      Sorry Paul,

      But the only poisonous atmosphere being created is by you. ‘moaners/whiners/whingers’ thats exactly what you are doing here. Pot Kettle?

      • Blue in Spain says:

        “Sorry Paul,

        But the only poisonous atmosphere being created is by you.”

        So all the other comments are fully justified…. wow I’ve read some pathetic posts in my time, but this one wins by a long shot!

        • blaneh says:

          Yes Blue, thats exactly word for word what i typed, ‘all other comments are fully justified’ you got it exactly right… my point was Paul, slating fans is as poisonous as any comments other people might be making, that he is as bad as them. Like I am now in responding to your pointless reply.

        • Art Watson says:

          Blue In Spain,

          Have you read your posts recently?

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    Course I am mate, its all my fault.

    The truth hurts. If you went to the games you’d know about the atmosphere I’m on about. Then theres the ‘fans’ who use every excuse going for not attending. Less money coming in = more players sold. Were you at Bolton or Barnsley? Have you already got your Huddersfield and Leeds tickets? Bet you ain’t even going tomorrow.

    • blaneh says:

      The ‘all fans apart from me are rubbish’ ideology you are portraying is your fault yes Paul, the provocing of fans on this forum is your fault Paul. Great you go to away games then? Have a cookie! you must be the no.1 fan, if only we were all as glorious as you, we would be top of the premiership. Yeah, I have got my ticket for tomorrow, got my ticket for every other home game this season too, like the 18 Seasons prior to that.

      Fact you don’t seem to realise is that IT IS NOT the fans fault we are in this position, its the muppets who have ran the club and the players and staff that have under performed for the club. Matchday takings do not decide whether a football club lives or dies at this level. There are plenty of other clubs in this division that cope with less support than blues have and without parachute payments from the premiership. As for supporting the team I will personally back any player that pulls on the royal blue shirt, even you Paul if you started playing. BUT when players/managers dont perform and dont give 100% they deserve everything they get from fans.

      • tony says:

        Have to agree,the same people that moan about fans moaning are the ones that come on here regularly just to slag off other supporters and give it the big i am.The voice of reason lmfao .. i go to every game home and away,have my leeds ticket,does that justify me sticking some half arse title after my name and let me slate everybody else because i’m oh so superior to everyone..

  • R SMITH says:

    I’m sick of people having a go at non attenders. They are not a disgrace. Football is an entertainment done for fun. It’s not like paying tax which is compulsory. People who don’t attend are expressing free will. I go but that’s my choice. Perhaps the non attenders are right, if enough stop going it may pressurise the owners into leaving.

    • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

      Eh???

      How can the owners leave if no one attends? Who they gonna sell it to? Who would wanna buy it?

      You really can’t see how non attendance affects the club?

      • Thongs says:

        Yet you continue to back a dead horse. Its over mate, We’ve all wasted our time and money over the years, don’t throw away any more. Buy your family something nice instead. I’m just looking out for you not having a go. The Blues are finished, it was good fun at times, terrible at others and now its all over. Just watch the Cup final DVD again and remember the best time of our lives. It will never happen again.

        Stop all the clocks, cut off the telephone,
        Prevent scar lady from barking with a juicy bone,
        Silence the Tilton and with a muffled keep right on
        Bring out the Blue shirt, let the mourners come.

        Let aeroplanes circle moaning overhead
        Scribbling on the sky the message Blues are Dead,
        Put blue scarves round the white necks of the public doves,
        Let the riot policemen wear black cotton gloves.

        Blues were my North, my South, my East and West,
        My working week and my Sunday rest,
        My noon, my midnight, my talk, my song;
        I thought that love would last for ever: I was wrong.

        The stars are not wanted now: sell everyone;
        Sell up St Andrews and say goodbye to Brum;
        Pour away the ocean of piss and sweep up the deadwood.
        For nothing now can ever come to any good.

        • SirHarry1875 says:

          We can do nothing about the current plight of our Club other than getting down there, getting behind our young lads and just enjoy the ride that is Birmingham City!

          If you could turn back time would you do it all again? If you would then then you were not born a Birmingham City fan, you were chosen. It’s an honour and you are one of the fortunate ones. So get down there it is your duty.

          For the Boys in Royal Blue

    • Blue in Spain says:

      So you think an empty ground will make the owners walk away? Personally I think an empty ground means more players will be sold to stay afloat. Or do you think they should just give the club away to the media whore and asset stripper Paladini, so he can syphon funds to his agent mates, for players no one wants (I assume thats ok Art Watson, as Paladini hasn’t proved he won’t do it!)

  • jon says:

    if as a lot are saying there will be no take over before the end of season and the sale of butland redmond etc then perhaps administration is the best we can hope for and why doesnt pannu try resurrect chans deal if he wants rid of bcfc ………… i realy do fear for the club admin relegation ………. happy new year to all !! kro

    • almajir says:

      Administration wouldn’t be the best thing at all for the club

      • Sirharry1875 says:

        We can do nothing about the current plight of our Club other than getting down there, getting behind our young lads and just enjoy the ride that is Birmingham City!

        If you could turn back time would you do it all again? If you would then then you were not born a Birmingham City fan, you were chosen. It’s an honour and you are one of the fortunate ones. So get down there it is your duty.

        For the Boys in Royal Blue.

  • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

    Dan I take it you got this tweet?

    Young Blues striker Marcel Henry-Francis, aged 19, has been given first-team squad number 38 ahead of tomorrow’s visit of Cardiff City

    Better than Jervis?

    • almajir says:

      I’d not seen it, but yes, IMO he is.

      He’s on non-contract terms so evidently something has been sorted so he can play. I’m happy about this.

      • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

        That don’t fill me with confidence if they didn’t rate him enough to sign him up

        • almajir says:

          It’s not to do with rating him mate, it’s money… we don’t have any. It really is that bad.

          • Paul Carter - The Voice Of Reason says:

            Sadly you’re right Dan, not a problem though cos all we’ve got to do is all stop going or go and moan/boo when things don’t go right. This will make everything better apparently and I learnt something today. Stayaway fans have no effect whatsoever on cashflow. Did you know that Dan? Nada.

            The tooth fairys sister the football fairy sprinkles her magic dust on the BCFC bank account and hey presto loadsamoney.

  • skareggae72 says:

    Can’t see us getting much for Redmond(on current form),we would have too sell way below his potential value,pref to keep,he could be a star in league 1.
    Personally i would prefer to see Mullins/Ambrose/Caldwell sent on loan & save on the wages,although not sure anyone wants them,and Mulls is clearly Clarks best mate.

  • tony says:

    whoever we sell in january will just be a sticking plaster on a gaping wound.Butland aside then Davies and King are propably the only other players worth anything.Redmond hasn’t really improved this season despite playing more games and the other senior players have been dreadful.If we survived january then god help us in the summer .

    Lets all go to the blues though and suport the team and bury our heads in the sand..

  • james says:

    More smoke and mirrors from Pannu.

    I will place any wager with any fan that we won’t be taken over in the next 12 months; the club is being bled dry until we have nothing left.

    We have sold 35 million pounds worth of assets plus parachute payments; “let’s not forget Zigic’s wages of 50k per week zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    The Paladini bid – nonsense
    The “mystery” HK groups – cobblers
    Let’s give Pannu a huge pat on the back as he’s truly amazing. Bore off
    The stay away fans – don’t come back ( funny how you had the funds in the last recession whilst we were in the prem. Odd)
    The BOO Boys – take yourself to Aston

    I’ll back the team and the manager; the above can go forth and multiply

    Happy New Year and Keep Right On

  • SirHarry1875 says:

    We can do nothing about the current plight of our Club other than getting down there, getting behind our young lads and just enjoy the ride that is Birmingham City!

    If you could turn back time would you do it all again? If you would then then you were not born a Birmingham City fan, you were chosen. It’s an honour and you are one of the fortunate ones. So get down there, it is your duty.

    For the Boys in Royal Blue.

  • Art Watson says:

    I have a very open mind!

    Can anyone give me concrete evidence as to why I should believe that all money generated from the sale of players will keep the club afloat?

    • almajir says:

      I would say this: I think if any money did start being moved from here to HK you’d hear about it. Believe me, you’d hear about it.

      • Art Watson says:

        Thanks,

        So who controls the money at club level and are they able to prevent money from being to transferred to HK?

        • almajir says:

          Without wishing to be condescending or sarcastic, you are aware that BCFC has a finance director? I think it would be within his remit.

          There are ways of doing things legally that would be difficult to counteract. However, I believe if it happened the crapola would hit the fan – partly because I would do my best to ensure that happened.

          • Art Watson says:

            Thanks,

            It’s been 7 years since I last lived in Brum so I’m out of touch with the company internal structure.

            I actually thought the FD was HK based with someone at STA reporting through to him or her.

            Sorry.

            Could the board overrule any decisions made by the current FD?

          • almajir says:

            Which board? BIH or BCFC? I suspect that all BIH would have to do would be to whack in a management charge and there would be naff all BCFC could do to stop it.

            The FD is a guy called Roger Lloyd, who’s a top bloke.

  • stevie blue says:

    Sorry Paul you just don’t get it do you? This problem s bigger than merely filling the ground? Did selling out every week stop Man City plummeting nto the third tier? Did good attendnaces stop Leicester, Leeds, Nottm F, Soton or Sheff W going the same way? Ultimatley its up to the board of any to ATTRACT fans and forgive me but I think you may just have a chance of doing that with an ambitious board that has a bit of foresight. How many of those have ended up in league 1?

  • Blueboy88 says:

    Almajir , can you ask your friends at the Mail why they are running features titled
    Revealed: The players YOU want at West Brom & Villa , but not doing the same for the Blues ?

    • almajir says:

      Are you expecting a serious answer to this question?

      Again, it’s hard not to be sarcastic here but it strikes me asking Blues fans who they’d like to sign is a tad cruel bearing in mind the club appears to be screwed and is going to be selling players agan in the window?

      Or am I missing something?

      • Blueboy88 says:

        The question is who you would want ,
        not who you can afford ….

        • almajir says:

          In that case, I want Messi, Ronaldo, Falcao, Sneijder, Casillas and Wes Hoolahan.

          • Blueboy88 says:

            So we are not grown up enough or worthy enough of discussing potential loan signings ?

          • almajir says:

            Like who?

            Name some, I will tell you now we’ll struggle to afford them – it was a fight to get Rob Hall on loan and that cost us virtually nothing in football terms.

          • skareggae72 says:

            Yes,and Ibrahimovic.
            Reading all these comments i would prefer us to go into adminstration tonight,and the administrators can deal with the club sales,at least their honesty would not be in question,a 10 point deduction might inspire a few players to show a bit more fight and energy,and the admin can oversee a new buyer/buyers ready for the summer, i would rather that happened than where we are now,as this could drag on for another 2 years or more!

      • Blueboy88 says:

        Your right , there’s absolutely no point even discussing it…waste of time….

        • almajir says:

          Well, it is if you can’t name these loan signings you’d like us to make that are realisticially within our grasp…

          • Blueboy88 says:

            What about Liverpools Danny Wison currently coming to the end of a two month loan at Bristol City,
            good centre half with a little more pace than we currently have, & can play full back ?

            By example , also if Butland went the other way , are there other Liverpool reserves that could do us a good job & be a part of the deal ?

            But if we are to believe the Mail it pointless even trying to have these discussions.
            Is it any wonder they are known as a Vile rag.
            Just sucking all hope out of the Blues again..

  • Callum says:

    If we end up selling are top players eg. Davies 4mil, butland 6mil, redmond 5mil and any one else they want to sell for money would equal about 20mil so if they turn around after january and then say the clubs in admin i will be wanting to know what happened to the money cus they evidently havent gone into blues, we need to stay in this league to rebuild not league 1 because a 10 point deduction would destroy us. Pannu sort it out, sell the club, and get the f out of birmingham.

  • skareggae72 says:

    Wes Hoolahan ? :)

  • tamuffblue says:

    internet warrior – support the club – get to Stanns – proof of this that and the other etc etc attacking all and sundry on here – signed by BLUE IN SPAIN !!!!!! yer a joke pal !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Ali Duncan says:

    I wonder if a better question would be: If we sell and bring in money then would be be able to consider realistic loans due to the freeing up of some finance – not just from transfer fees but reducing the wage bill too?

  • 'irsty says:

    The atmosphere down StAns this season is undoubtably poisonous. I’m a season ticket holder but have missed 5 or 6 games this season partly through apathy but mainly because I don’t like to subject by 2 lads to the unpleasant vibe down there. I’ve had a season ticket for 20 years now and I went down on and off for 10 years before that. Even when we were shite in the past (let’s be honest that’s been more than a handful of seasons!) I’ve never heard booing before the kick off. I’ve never heard bile an vitriol hurled at a manager who at least seems to be trying. The humours gone, the banters gone and my love for my club is slowly diminishing. And that is down to the fans. Not the owners, not the manager, not the players…

  • Blue in Spain says:

    Art, How pathetically hypocritical are you……

    “Blue in Spain.

    You obviously don’t have any evidence so you resort to personal attacks”

    What like you talking about Pannu and Yeung (financially raping the club and other slurs), What personal attacks? The only personal attacks i make are on people that have personally attacked someone else. So old man, if you can’t take it don’t dish it out!

    And as for you having an open mind… yeh right

  • KeepRightcroydOn says:

    Interesting comments by LC in the Mail about player sales in Jan. Looks like he’s angling for getting rid of senior players who are performing below par rather than kids like Butland & Redmond. Allied to his post match comments after Sat when he was scathing in his criticism of senior players not pulling their weight, and praising the youngsters for their energy and effort, it looks like he’s decided to bank on youth.
    Sure he won’t get a lit in transfer fees fir some if the old uns, but at least he’ll get the high earners off the payroll. Personally I’d be delighted if thus is his plan, and if PP buys into it – especially if it means holding on to our best young prospects which is good for the future and will make us more attractive to a potential buyer. The big question is, who does he think are the ones who are not pulling their weight?

    • almajir says:

      That’s the impression I got too.

      • KeepRightcroydOn says:

        I think LC’s had his fill with copping the flak after many experienced players are under performing once they cross the white line. While the buck stops with him, it’s understanable that he feels let down by some who it would appear are not pulling their weight.

        • Tonytree says:

          But who is going to buy the ‘experienced’ players? They are not really saleable assets are they. It will be Butland for sure and maybe Redmond to join the other kids at Villa. The money from sales will only stave off the inevitable and administration beckons – 10 point deduction will mean certain relegation and then I am afraid to say we’ve reached the ‘end of the road’

  • james says:

    Here here – some of the senior players this year just don’t look interested.

    There’s a lot of pressure on the kids until the end of the season and if we stay up, we should all be thankful ( although until its mathematically impossible I’ll still be keeping an eye on 6th!)

    My rant earlier was a tad ott, but still feel we are miles away from a deal, which in the short term harms the club.

    I’d be gutted to see any of are best players go this season, esp Butland & Davies – lose them and its going to be a monumental struggle.

    KRO

  • Dave says:

    there are many true fans who have followed the Blues since the 40s who are staying away because they are uncertain that the money they pay into the club isn’t going directly to Hong Kong. this is a reasonable concern from lifelong fans and something that Pannu is unable to address as BIH accounts have not been submitted.


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